the bitcoin group the american original for over the last 10 years the sharpest setosis
the best bitcoins the hardest cryptocurrency talk we'd like to welcome our panelists victoria jones
from satoshi's page evening everybody jameson lopp from casa how are you ben arc from ln bits
even though glad costa from bitcoin takeover magazine hello i've waited here for you
ever long and i'm thomas hunt from the world crypto network moving on issue one the price
the price the price the price of bitcoin the price of bitcoin is eighty four thousand four
hundred and sixty seven dollars a coin down or it's up four point four percent in the last 24 hours
that's one dollar for one thousand one hundred and eighty four satoshis just on the wrong side
of the thousand satoshi barrier but first a message from the president of the united states
the federal government is already among the largest holders of bitcoin as you know who knows
sell your bitcoin that's america will follow the rule that every bitcoin knows very well never sell
your bitcoin that's a little phrase that they have i don't know if that's right or not who the hell
knows right never sell your bitcoin who the hell knows as it says here michael saylor likely spent
millions lobbing lobbying donald trump to say never sell your bitcoin but instead he says i don't know
if they're right or not who the hell knows the crypto verse bitcoin's bear market has hit the newcomers the
hardest with people who have just bought bitcoin and the trump run-up taking the most of losses
and seller exhaustion may be incoming sooner rather than later but let's go to our panel victoria jones
bitcoin it's great i guess and what do you think about the price go ahead yeah it's very disappointing i
mean i think uh a lot of older bitcoiners who follow the cycles aren't expecting weren't expecting it to
have topped just quite yet um and uh and who knows you know some i think in 2021 it dipped and then went
straight back up again so we could be on the road to doing that or we could have already topped it's
really difficult to tell and i think part of the problem is because we've now got um the exchange traded funds
involved um you know they've got huge financial resources and they have the ability to um influence
the market either way which has already disrupted the cycle i mean in many respects uh we took off
on the bull market much sooner than we would have done otherwise and it may well be that you know the
the bull market's broken sooner than we'd done otherwise and so it's very difficult to tell i mean at the
moment uh the bit the stock market appears to be struggling uh i hear on the grapevine that warren
buffett is selling every single stock that he can get his hand on hands on pretty much so he's expecting
something um and again because of the etfs i think uh the price of bitcoin could well be much more tied
to the stock market than it has been than it has been in the past it's very influenced by um the money
supply and although there is um additional money supply in the market you know the government's doing
everything they can to try and slow down inflation and so that may well uh be putting breaks on the
price compared to you know the the massive bull market that people were expecting so um yeah
disappointing not terribly surprising that i've been saying this for a long time um you know i don't
think market conditions are necessarily um you know uh favorable for the kind of bull markets we've had in
the past um but you know as donald trump says who the hell knows indeed who the hell knows and warren
buffett he's smarter than any of us he already sold before all of this happens he's sitting in t-bells
watching the rest of the market go and as we've talked about before this is a temporary reprieve
they bribed donald trump he doesn't actually believe in any of this i know you want him to
believe and he's made the speeches that made you think he believes but just like with ross olbrecht
the drug war is not over the bitcoin war is not over of course who the hell knows maybe he'll change
his mind tomorrow jameson lopp what do you think about the price of bitcoin and of course our fair
weather friend in the white house uh i don't think much about the price it's kind of a waste of time
thinking about uh i don't think we've ever had a bull market that went straight up without having
corrections you know it's it's different every time but it also rhymes uh so there's different
specific reasons for why these things happen but that's just the general trend you don't go straight
up um you did trigger me with uh that jacob king account that well-known fudster and long-time
scammer uh formerly known as crypto whale uh he should be blocked and muted by everyone
you should not listen to that guy at all i mean this is fud right here we have absolutely there's
no proof that sailor has spent any money on political lobbying i don't think he has to spend money on
lobbying he's spent enough money to buy like all of the lobbying and goodwill that he ever needs you know
just by putting himself in the current financial position of uh biggest bitcoin shill of all time
pretty good pretty good we'll have to see how it goes uh let's go to ben ark what do you think about
the price and the uh person in the white house who may or may not support the bitcoin yeah it's interesting
you say that jameson because i had the same um impression of that tweet that it just seemed it
seemed a bit sensationalist and like he was just trying to get grab a few cheap likes uh i didn't
take it for you know to be actual newsworthy um but yeah it got the same vibe we had it's just a wet
flannel uh the whole uh strategic bitcoin reserve thing and i thought to be honest i thought i kind of
admired trump's clever wordplay in that he's like yeah i'm doing the thing but you know because he's sort of
signaling to people who might not trust bitcoin that you know i'm not really i'm just sort of doing it
half-assed i'm not really doing the thing whatever they say this and so i thought it was quite some
quite good wordplay on his part because it kind of keeps them happy as well uh but the whole thing
was a wet flannel like the we had this sort of perfect storm of good news which tends to happen to
drive bull markets and get them started um and then that kind of stopped and then it's not really
you know the strategic bitcoin reserve is just the bitcoin they've stolen and now they're just saying
they're not going to sell it um so they're just doing in action and then they're calling it a
bitcoin strategic reserve and i do think that there's probably a whole bunch of wall street
bros who've made a quick book on the classic you know buy the rumor sell the news like people who trade
on that and it was the play in this case you know it was by the rumor sell the news um and it played out
well for them so i think that's probably a lot of downward pressure on the old price there but i'm
pretty bearish i think this probably it's probably buckled the the upward trend and and now we're
probably just gonna have a multi-year like bear cycle now so sorry about that um
yeah what you're gonna do goes up it goes down
clever wordplay that's not what we paid for i want to get what we paid for
vlad costa what do you think about the president and the price of bitcoin
i wonder if everything everything could ever be this real forever if everything could ever be this
good again and i'll stop with the foo fighters references now i i think they're getting old i
think trump is a master of deniability so he knows exactly what to say because he's been involved in
lawsuits for decades now and he knows exactly that he's supposed to say that just in case
who the hell knows i don't know maybe someone knows but not me whatever never sell your bitcoin nice phrase
so i i know for a fact that he he basically introduced nihilism into the market with his trump token
and from that point onwards what he proved with the trump token is that most of the prices are overvalued
because if someone can just come in and with just one d5 platform on solana get in the top 20 of
cryptos he basically signaled to the rest of the market okay everything is overvalued because you can
do this i mean imagine all all the people working on something like i don't know ethereum classic or
whatever there's some development there they spent years working on that one just to get flipped even
monero when i got flipped by the trump token in one day just by you can just do things vlad
we're in the you can just do things phase and he is very very famous like him or don't like him agree
with him politically he's a very very famous man monero doesn't carry the kind of weight of that similar
name yeah there's value and and utilitarian investment and then there's speculative investment
and we're definitely in the like speculative uh investment market right now like that's what meme
coins have taken us to the furthest extreme edge away from value investing and you know it's actually
kind of the sec's fault you know they they basically were pushing so hard on the howey test for so many
years that everyone was like all right we won't promise anything at all we're just gonna put crypto tokens up and
you can basically speculate based on how funny or how popular that one word or idea is
it's all about a name and an image as we were talking about before the show there's a recently
launched ass coin i don't think you should buy it it's a little like the movie ass in the idiocracy
we've gotten to that level but yes if you're interested ass coin is available thomas is pumping
us coin oh yeah i got a bag got a bag uh vlad uh any more on this issue go back to you are you pumping
gas thomas not pumping ass uh but it was fun that you mentioned uh dave grohl and the foo fighters i am
listening to his audiobook storyteller right now it's really cool he's uh in a punk rock band living in the
van and uh on his way to stardom so everyone should check out storyteller uh before we run out of time here
we're gonna move on to the exit question predicting against the magic bitcoin predictor ball the source
of all knowledge in the future victoria jones will the price be higher or lower this time next week
uh well we've been on the downward trajectory for a bit so maybe it's time for a little bit of reprieve
so i'd say higher positivity all right jameson lopp higher or lower as a permable the answer is always
higher see that's what i say and then i get destroyed in the market ben arc higher or lower i think unless
there's some um some event which shows to people that trump isn't a lunatic um maybe the ukraine war
thing stops then but i think that might give the markets a little more faith in his decision making
and then things like bitcoin will go up but until that happens we're just gonna keep going lower
it is so hard now there's so much uncertainty out there if you were working for a company and you had
to order widgets and you had to deliver widgets you don't know how many widgets you're going to need
that kind of uncertainty bad for the stock market bad for people wanting to do what they still call
risk investing and that means bitcoin vlad costa higher or lower this time next week i want to say
higher because my rent is due but honestly i think we've had all the bullish narratives play out we've
had everything that we expected somewhat coming and happening and yet the price doesn't follow and my
intuition is that these i'm not sure if they're government agencies or
local governments or whatever buying bitcoin it seems like the federal government just decided to
keep the seized coins and that's the reserve but i'm i'm pretty sure that if they're going to buy they
want to buy lower and they're going to manipulate the sentiment on the market towards this just like
blackrock did before the etf so maybe for next week lower well certainly the news on bitcoin has never
been more positive but that's not doing anything for the price uh let's see what the ball thinks will
the price of bitcoin be higher this time next week of course shaking it can cause bubbles and it says as i see it
yes as i see it yes the ball has spoken everyone can push their orders in go ahead and push by right
now you're all set moving on to issue two u.s senator and congressman introduce strategic bitcoin reserve
bills to buy one million bitcoin cynthia loomis from wyoming and others have launched a bitcoin for america
summit where the lawmakers announced their plan for a federal bitcoin reserve that would see the united
states buy one million bitcoin jameson lopp is this the bitcoin reserve we've promised and given that
nothing has passed congress i think in years is there any opportunity or any chance that this will pass congress
uh i would be very surprised if it did um you know one of my many projects is tracking
which politicians actually have skin in the bitcoin game and uh last i checked i think it's still only
around 10 or so members of congress uh i think there's a higher concentration of bitcoin owners uh
more in the like cabinet and closer trump circles so yeah i don't really see the incentives there like
in general i think the democrats are still very anti-crypto and a lot of the republicans still don't
get it so i think there's a lot of education that needs to be done ben ark a real crypto reserve bill
one million bitcoin i mean yeah it's probably going to go through but i mean stories like that might urge
some of the governments to start buying some bitcoin or whatever or some states to individually start
buying up some bitcoin i don't know maybe that'll be a good thing for the price who knows but um
yeah it's not going anywhere that pasta what about the bitcoin reserve is this the one we've been waiting for
sure but why just stop at 1 million why not buy 2 million 2 million 3 million whatever good luck finding that though
victoria jones the government buying bitcoin everything good here
i think the whole notion is completely ridiculous i mean if you actually understand bitcoin and the way in
which fiat currency works i mean you know government and bitcoin are just two completely incompatible
systems and ultimately bitcoin is going to eat fiat currencies lunch so all they're doing is they're
just pressing ahead on their own destruction but of course you know as jameson says you know there's a
lot of education you know in many respects the very knowledgeable bitcoiners are preying on
their naivety and um it's just a race against time to see how long it takes before they figure it out
well and again these are the people who run the entire government they run the president the house
the senate they could talk to the federal reserve they could say hey print more money print less money
make a digital federal reserve coin whatever their problem is with the existing system they own the
dollar whenever they bring these bills up it drives me crazy because they're advertising against
the dollar they're advertising against the thing their own uh unless there may be traders to the
country and they want the united states and the uh dollar being the world's reserve coin to fail
which would be chaotic and bad for business uh i don't understand this the the idea that a few
million bitcoin could somehow pay off the national debt if they sold the bitcoin to pay off the debt
they'd crash the price of bitcoin okay if they try to buy the bitcoin stealthily or secretly they're still
buying so many they drive up the price of bitcoin uh unfortunately i have to agree with the hundreds
of articles written by the mainstream media where they all label this as an attempt for bitcoiners and
maybe alt coiners to get the government to buy their bags it looks bad it doesn't make any sense they
own the dollar they own the world's reserve currency uh if you don't like how it runs change it don't throw
it away lose all of your power uh this doesn't make any sense but then i don't know they could
they could they could do it go ahead maybe this was the sailor was i mean it was all about maybe say
there was like look this usd thing you know we're going to lose our hydronomy and when we do when it
starts through the death spiral we're just going to print a load of dollar and then buy some bitcoin
print dollars buy bitcoin print dollars buy bitcoin sell government bonds buy bitcoin maybe that's the plan
do you think sailor understands bitcoin though yeah and with every buy they would get less with
every buy they would get less bitcoin they would print more dollars they would get less bitcoin almost
seems like satoshi's plan from the beginning and something we've talked about before that the more
they print the less they get it makes no sense and again they own the dollar if you're in any other
government any other business and you're like we should have a bitcoin reserve that's fine you don't own the
dollar these guys don't know you have to think outside the box uh remember there's always the
china strategy they could ban bitcoin buy a ton of it unban it ban it again buy a bunch of it you know
that's the thing is like the the government has enough power to manipulate the markets if they really
wanted to and and also remember that sailor somehow you know has been hoovering up half a million bitcoin
over the past few years and uh the price still goes down a lot and he just borrows more money and buys
more bitcoin it is strange we haven't seen another buy from sailor though there's been no strategy buys
during this dip or this bear market or whatever you want to say so he does seem to oh it's coming
and he sells and he sells quite a lot of bitcoin too because he has to manage his accounts so if you
watch the reports you know the company reports will state when they've had to sell bitcoin as well
you could also you could also sell government bonds based on the bitcoin you've got in your reserve
while you're printing dollars and buying bitcoin you could then say well look we've got this asset
which is going up so let me let us sell you our government bonds because our government's going to
be worth more in the future and offset the price of the well and then you could also put the taxes
up and then destroy the dollars as they come in to try and make up for the fact you're printing them
printing them more money that's what the mmt is would say well and there's yeah bro but it's the game
theory it's the software have you even read the book it's like a research paper that was published by
a free letter agency if i'm not mistaken or the pentagon or i don't know i'm slightly drunk but
my point here is that you know the us is gonna buy up all the bitcoin and then china's gonna buy all the
bitcoin and then russia is gonna buy all the bitcoin and you're gonna be able to feed five generations
from now on just with 0.01 bitcoin and then you're gonna live in a citadel and you're gonna be isolated
from the normies and you're not gonna have to deal with their fiat habits again just because this god
emperor trump decided one day to buy your coins to buy your bags and that's important huddle never sell
your bitcoin that that's the plan right that's why bitcoin exists read the white paper bitcoin a peer-to-peer
reserve currency for the us government and game theory that's going to push other nation states
into buying it too that's the mission right with a subtitle and everyone gets lambos it sounds pretty
good it's not quite what we read originally but i like it let's move on to the exit question now that
we've had the trump bitcoin reserve as we said the stolen and seized coins now we have the congress or
senate idea of a bitcoin reserve which is likely not going to happen the bitcoin price has fallen by
6.5 as volatility continues after trump's bitcoin reserve plan is there any positive news out there
is there anything good that you can think about that's going to happen in the future for bitcoin a lot
of people had hoped if this strategic reserve comes through that changes the price around jameson lopp
tell me something good about bitcoin for the future
well i mean bitcoin doesn't care about all of this other stuff you know it doesn't even
know that it has an exchange rate so the the foundational principles of the system
are sound and it's going to continue operating now if what you care about is the the purchasing power
of your bitcoin then sure there's a lot of other external factors that go into that and it's quite
volatile on a day-to-day basis but the scarcity is set in stone that's not going to be changing really
the only thing that we're seeing now it's a new cycle it's a new cohort of adopters and so that's why
everybody's talking about nation states or even states or you know institutions so this is i think
really the question is how might the nature of bitcoin itself change if indeed this institutional adoption
really plays out and what i mean by that is like from a governance standpoint you know where are all of
these pools of bitcoin going are they all going to be held by a few custodians because that can have
potential governance ramifications um i think we should be thinking adversarially about well what
happens if a small number of institutions have a huge amount of bitcoin and they decide to start taking
an interest in the actual development of the protocol you know that could have some massive uh government
or governance related implications as well if we end up having some sort of controversial changes proposed
and the institutions are for it and everybody else is against it or vice versa what have you
it would be a very different system if you had to have a thousand bitcoins to make a commit to the
system or maybe have a thousand bitcoins vote for you or something else it's a very different
programming environment uh ben arc jameson did pretty good do you have anything positive about bitcoin for
the future yeah we do have to be on guard i mean we saw it with sailor um to jameson's point we saw it
with sailor when when he started to have just more influence within the space then he he started you
know pushing sort of his agenda to to keep bitcoin as just digital gold as opposed to um money and
medium of exchange which is the thing i'm really interested in and you know banking the unbank and all
that jazz there's some cool stuff going on down in suriname there's a bitcoin president um mayor um
the lady who's running for president and uh i was chatting to a friend of mine who's down there at
the moment and and she says i think she thinks there's a lot of potential there um i think off the back of
the el salvador event uh i would so they're using gallois stable sats a little bit more which is which
which i like it's good because i think that really is the barrier to entry when it comes to medium of
exchange for um subsistence wage earning uh unbanked people so it will be good to see more examples of
bitcoin i mean christ you can take unbanked people and then suddenly they've got access to digital money
and they can bootstrap an economy that's fantastic but we got to figure out you know the the pain points
such as stability so um but it ultimately in the bitcoin dialectic it you know will fear it will compete
with it because now it exists and then bitcoin will compete with fear hence the requirement for stability
um and then but ultimately bitcoin has properties which fear can't have such as um you know it's
decentralized nature and lack of a trusted third party or need for trusted third parties uh so
ultimately bitcoin will become nash's ideal money and we just got to wait that out that dialectic
the bitcoin dialectic as it plays out competition bitcoin doesn't like competition it likes submission
vlad kassa what about the future of bitcoin tell me something positive
on my show i interview a lot of developers and a lot of them are very optimistic about something
that they want to bring to bitcoin to increase the ways in which you can use it to increase the utility
it's just that i think the current huddle culture or right now it's not called huddle anymore it's
never sell your bitcoin and syb it's what stands in the way of most of these use cases ever getting
traction maybe that they're cool when they're a novelty but sooner or later people will say you know
bitcoin is for saving bitcoin is for this and that and it's unfortunate because you see other currencies
like monero and litecoin getting traction on other markets and being used as peer-to-peer cash whereas
bitcoin i don't think the lightning network became too successful and ben can basically attest to that
because he has one of the best lightning companies if not the best one that i'm aware of right now
and liquid never went anywhere and i guess it's because it's a federation and they sort of gave up
on having a proper two-way pegged sidechain i think there are lots of good ideas like i interviewed the
three young developers robin linus and jonas nick and i remember liam egan that's his name and they
developed this shielded client-side validation that is very cool it's basically like a protocol sort of
like counterparty where every transaction has 50 bytes in size i i don't want to say anything wrong
i'll assume it's 50 bytes but it might be lower than this and they all look the same and it it sort of
looks like zcash transactions they use zk snarks for that and it's so cool and it's exactly what i what i
expect from bitcoin these ways to make transactions more efficient and more private in some hacky way because it
seems like it seems like we're not going to get a hard fork to add that to bitcoin but this is exactly what
gives me hope that one day we're gonna have the perfect sort of money we need a change of culture i think
first and foremost so people accept the fact that others may use bitcoin in ways that they don't like
otherwise we're gonna see wbtc becoming much bigger i think bitgo and
the guys from ethereum they're very much ahead of the curve and they understood they can do this to
extend the way in which you can use your btc right now wbtc on ethereum is like a hundred times bigger
than lightning which is incredible because i don't see anyone tweeting and saying hey look i just sent a
payment with wbtc just like they do with lightning there's no cult around it but it seems like there's a lot of
activity there's liquidity there's liquidity and i would love to see more of that there are lots of
projects that try to create these zk roll-ups that basically serve the purpose of trying to undermine the
dominance of wbtc on ethereum they're trying to get some of that liquidity with something that has better
trust assumptions because there is no centralized custodian but they need covenants to be able to
just launch on the mainnet and that one also seems less likely because the covenant conversation has
been going for like four years now it started with ctv when jeremy tried to go for a speedy trial
and for a while it just seemed like everyone's coming with a new covenant proposal there was an attempt to
unify all of them and call it the great stripped restoration that one never really got traction
now i think the latest consensus and jameson can attest to that is ctv plus c what's the abbreviation for
it uh cf uh check sig from stack c s f s c f s so that's the latest proposal right now to get these two
because they are the least harmful or at least theoretically but at the same time i see a lot
of people just being complacent and saying yeah bitcoin is already ossified there's nothing we can do
about it it's a store of value i see roger ver promoting bitcoin on private blockchains like zano
i saw him getting on interviews talking about that and that one seems more realistic practically i mean you can
do that you can tokenize btc on other blockchains and use it with the primitives of those other
blockchains but with different trust assumptions and security trade-offs and i wish it was on bitcoin but
i don't know why it takes so long to just agree on something at this point i'm happy with any proposal
being adopted just to build more stuff and bring more users it's very interesting sachoshi may have
launched the revolution but it might not be the revolution that he wanted things don't just turn
out the way you have planned even when you have such great plans as he or they had uh victoria jones what
do you think about bitcoin tell me something positive about bitcoin for the future i know it's gonna be hard
well i mean i i definitely believe in um bitcoin's underlying infrastructure i mean it's still the most
powerful uh cryptocurrency yes there are lots of competitors but i think that's just symptomatic of
bitcoin's stage of development you know there are a lot of people who are still woefully unaware of
exactly what's going on with the financial system how much danger they're in there are some people who still
don't even understand inflation um you know the people who understand bitcoin properly properly is
tiny compared to um the rest of the population and until it becomes easy um you know on a universal basis
to transact with you know until you get to the stage where businesses want bitcoin and nothing else
um i think um you know it's going to be a struggle and i think at the moment that's a good thing because
there are still a lot of details to be ironed out um a lot of ways in which you want to make it um
you know easier to transact with obviously you know we've had great hopes for the lightning network it's
still in development i know there are a number of people who are still heavily working on that but you
know it takes time to build these things you know rome was not built in a day um and um you know i think
i think everyone's doing the best they can to get this as far as possible um and although you know
everything that's going on in the us with the senators and everything feels like big news i mean
ultimately it's in some ways a distraction but in other ways it's good because at least it's making
people aware of the technology and hopefully getting them to look into it in a bit more depth i think
long-term bitcoin will be fine i think this is just you know all part of the show uh as we get to where we
want to go and um you know i love every minute of it i think it's a great show
well remember the best things about bitcoin is that it's shiny and it's gold
let's move on to the next issue check out worldcryptonetwork.com we've got 4 212 videos
it seems like most of them are shorts with my face on them but you can check them out at worldcryptonetwork.com
hopefully this week we'll be able to make some new shorts without my face on them moving on to issue
three fake fbi agent directs new sir marina woman to deposit twenty thousand dollars in bitcoin atm machine
we've covered this kind of story all the time but it is getting bigger and bigger this story was picked
up by the usa today one of the largest newspapers in the united states and just shows how widespread this
process has become uh ben arc what do you think for years we've talked about bitcoin atms as a great way
to get people started on some sats uh originally even you could get uh no kyc stats at an atm uh now it
seems they're mainly used for scams what do you think about the general public learning about bitcoin
as that thing that somebody stuck all of our money in the machine and sent it away coin i mean i guess
when these stories come out people learn a little bit more about some of these social engineering
attacks and um it's quite a sophisticated attack reading the article i felt so sorry for the poor
old dude who just lost her husband um very sad you know scammers they're scumbags some of them are
desperate scumbags i'm not sure if that excuses it but you know it's part of the problem with the
celebration of of greed and just accumulation and um lack of you know sort of moral fiber it may be a
modern site i don't know maybe there's always been scumbags um very sad i felt sorry for her and uh it's
not i mean people use these atms for legitimate things uh but i mean every time one of these
articles comes out it's a good thing because people read it and they're a little bit more aware of the
social engineering attacks which are out there and the amount of people who are trying to get your money
from you so hopefully some other old deer will be won't be in the same circumstance by reading that article
it does seem like they always seem to attack the weakest people and as we've seen it's almost an
international game now much like video games when you go on the internet to play someone in a video
game you end up playing someone so much better than you in the same way these people who have just
suffered tragedy just received money they're on the radar for some reason they don't have internationally
strong defenses uh to fight off the best scammers it seems in the world uh vlad costa what do you think
about the bitcoin atm scamming issue
a couple of years ago i was in switzerland and i saw something similar i think it was called maison
de satoshi which means house of satoshi and there was this old woman who went inside and they had this
non-kyc atm i think it was non-kyc below 1000 swiss francs or something and she entered and she asked
how to use the atm and the owner of the place explained everything to her and asked her what
do you want to do and she said oh i got this ransomware on my computer and if i want to unlock it i have to pay
this amount to this account this address and to my surprise the owner of the place was like okay
just have fun this is how you use it go ahead i'm not gonna stop you i'm not gonna tell you how
to remove ransomware from your computer it was sad to see and i didn't know how to help because
i don't speak french very well but yeah it happens and unfortunately i think it's not
that it targets the most vulnerable people i think it targets a lot of people but it's
these people who are technically not very good and they don't know how to remove malware from
their computers they fall for it and they realize they don't have any other choice or at least so they
think and they go to the nearest atm and they send money and it's unfortunate but i don't know if there's
if it wasn't what bitcoin they would just send some suitcase with cash
so this is just a bit more convenient for scammers
it's interesting with the ransomware sometimes they do actually unlock the digital locker and
give the people back their files i would assume they would just rip everybody off and run with the
money so you don't get anything from paying either but sometimes they do unlock it so maybe it was worth it
for her to pay uh victoria jones what do you think about the bitcoin atms and their potential use for
scams yeah it is a it is a real shame i mean a few years before um bitcoin was even invented i was um
a victim of someone attempting a similar scam with uh the software coming up on my computer and they
wanted me to download software which you know fortunately because i'd use the same software in my
own business um i knew exactly what they were doing so the moment they told me to do it i was
like hang on a minute um and they just sounded dodgy on the phone but again if i hadn't had that
experience and i didn't understand how that software worked i would have been taken in by it because
especially in that moment you know it's a real panic and you know a lot of a lot of us rely on our
computers these days so to suddenly have something like that come up and of course that's what they're
exploiting it's that moment of panic and then of course you know after that they're not thinking
um i think it's a real shame though that you know she should turn up you know this the story
just shared a moment ago where someone turned up at a place and the owner of the atm machine didn't
step in i mean obviously we've got a friend we talked about last time i was on the show um who did
that all the time you know the number of people who came in and were feeding the bitcoin atm notes as
a result of uh you know having one scam or another um you know it's just really sad that
it's possible and that people fall for it but you know as i just said these scams were around a number
of years before bitcoin um and if it wasn't bitcoin it would be something else they've just got a new tool
in order to exploit it but unfortunately these stories do give a bad name because people
you know hear these stories and bitcoin is all they stick with i mean there's a very famous um
series on disney plus called gray's anatomy and even in there they created a whole episode around
someone hijacking the hospital's computer system because someone wanted ransom in bitcoin and they
ended up solving the situation by just giving them the bitcoin so even the media doesn't help because it
just demonstrates that that's the quickest way to sort it out because for a hospital they had the money
but people were dying so they just needed the quick solution so it's unfortunate but you know scammers
are always gonna they've been here for a long time they're always going to be here and we just have
to get more sophisticated at spotting them and trying to fight back it really does show the power of
social engineering as well as you see from the example here they keep the lady on the phone the whole
time so she's driving to the convenience store she's using the machine all of this it's almost as if
she's in contact with her business agent and you wouldn't want to interrupt her you wouldn't want to
mess her up and they're also giving her the confidence where she may lack it normally to put
twenty thousand dollars into a machine i don't think anybody's ever handled that much money let alone put
it in a machine where it sends it away but if you got somebody there on the line saying send the money
you know we're going to get your husband out of jail we're going to fix your tax problem we're
going to unlock your computer whatever it is uh it's the same thing uh let's finally let's go to
jameson lop sorry i also want to add that scamming has become more sophisticated these days especially
with ai a couple of months ago there was someone who got the phone number of my dad and he knew my name
and he called my dad and said you know your son just had a terrible accident and he was put in a
helicopter to be taken to a hospital and do surgery and it's an emergency and you need to send money
right now for the surgery and blah blah blah and he was very convincing and very aggressive and wanted to
emphasize that it's an urgent issue and all he had to do was just call me and i was like hi what happened
but the the point is that now with ai they can even emulate voices and especially people like us
who are exposed on the internet and there are recordings of us they can make us say anything and
just make a phone call from some sim card that they just bought and they're going to dump on a burner phone
and tell that i don't know make up some story and ask for money and they can perpetuate the scam
and it's a bit scary that's a good shout flag we should probably make all make all of our families
a little bit more aware of that and really thought about that one but yeah good point it's also clear
that ai is making the scripts better uh originally these people might not be good at speaking or might
not be good at scamming you could just ask the ai how can i write a speech to scam someone how can
you make it more emotional uh things like this uh jameson what do you think about the atms and
potentially they're only used for scams or mainly used for scams it seems
yeah i mean look bitcoin uh changes incentives in a number of different ways it's not just about you
know the financial monetary system but it's it actually it has allowed a number of attacks that have always been
possible to be much more monetizable so i remember you know 20 years ago when i was just starting out
building software as a service platforms you know we had cyber security issues that we had to deal with
we had all types of attacks many similar attacks of what you see today but back then you know if you're
running some big software as a service company it's hard to monetize an attack um really what they would
have to hope for is they would have to hope for getting into your database and finding some valuable
like personal identifiable information that then they could go sell on some uh black market somewhere
and then of course there's always the questions of how would they actually uh sell that like may they would
probably do it for things like gift cards or other digital items that were available back then and
and now these days um you know you can perpetrate similar types of attacks at least to get ingress into
a system and take it over but because now we have this new highly liquid bearer asset that is native internet
money you can just ask for that instead instead of having to jump through all of these other hoops
of trying to take some other valuable asset and turn it into money so that's what we're really seeing is
um you know the a lot of the attacks and the attack vectors are similar in nature but what they're going
after instead is the direct monetary value so you know instead of hacking into large institution uh
networks and trying to steal stuff uh they'll you know hack into these hospitals and other large systems
and just lock everything up and say you know we know that this is valuable to you it wouldn't be very
valuable to us but you you know we can come to some sort of agreement and uh get you back online
it is amazing how bitcoin has removed the friction from this system i could talk about jameson they used
to have these same viruses on dos and it would say uh get a cashier's check mail it to this address
it had a lot more instructions now it's just send your bitcoin to this you know big long string of
numbers and letters uh so it's gotten a lot easier and uh it's drawn a lot more people to the game as
we've seen from all those youtube videos where they keep busting all the scammers they've got factories of
these people working on this it's a job uh for some people and again they're always hitting the old the
poor the weak uh the lack of information people uh but let's keep moving we're running out of time
and this kind of ties into our last topic where jameson was saying how are they going to cash out
that money how are they going to cash out that value it turns out issue four north koreans cash out
hundreds of millions from the 1.5 billion dollar by bit hack originally they had ethereum it sounds like
they may have used something called thor chain to convert the ethereum to bitcoin and it seems like
north korea has become incredibly successful and is now sitting on the proceeds from the buy bit hack
ben ark what do you think about the buy bit hack and the way in which the uh hackers were able to
successfully it seems allegedly laundering their money yeah i mean the north korea is one of the biggest
industries now it's just these hacking farms of guys very competent people um you know hundreds of
them just hacking everything and and the bitcoin industry is right for it um i remember years ago
when we first started working on bits and we were actually talking about how it's kind of an issue that
generally free and open source projects which has a lot of good will within the community
weren't weren't hacked so we weren't uh hardened because we weren't being hacked enough and i
remember we were kind of complaining about it that like no one actually tries to hack the software
um and then it was about a month ago things have changed so radically so about a month ago
i set up like a little phoenix d node put about 50 000 stats on it i did a little shill video
um on for for nostra um and there was like a fraction of a second where uh i leaked the the
key for the phoenix d um but it was kind of like a blurry video so i watched the video and i thought
ah it'll be all right it's only 50 000 sats it's not gonna happen whatever um and then it was literally
20 minutes the the phoenix d was drained um so there's there's people just they're just watching
they're just ready for as soon as you launch one of these videos that is the over the shoulder attack
and of course now you know we've um we've we've plugged that uh attack vector um by by hiding the
the credential now so i guess that mean phoenix ultimately had our wish fulfilled that we've now
got these state-sponsored north korean hackers watching our every movement waiting to pounce on
us and steal our money and i suppose ultimately as well it makes all of our software and all of our
projects that little bit more hard and the fact that we've got this state-sponsored hacking attacking
us in all sorts of sophisticated ways but it's really quite remarkable um you know i you could you
could time it i could i could maybe i should do it as just an experiment like post up a video and and
leak something and and and just see how quick because it was lit it was 20 minutes and the node was
drained i lost my whatever it is 50 quid alas well it just shows all the old days where you'd program
something and put a temporary credential in there those days are over if you ever put a temporary
password or an easy password you're basically giving the money away of lad koster what do you
think about the north korean hackers and their incredible success at laundering the funds
on popular opinion i guess maybe not in this panel but if you post this on twitter you're gonna get burned
i sort of respect the torching people for not rolling back the transactions and saying you know
it's the nature of the game it's permissionless it's technology and we're not supposed to intervene here
even though it's politically nice and we would be helping some people that we know
against some other people that we dislike they they decided to not intervene
that's ballsy i guess especially in this environment that has become more regulated
and more coercive to everything that is trying to be truly permissionless and decentralized i'm not
saying that tor chain is like the epitome of decentralization they have their own flaws but
i sort of respect them for this i'm not happy with the outcome the fact that north korea has
a lot of bitcoin right now but i don't know it's just tools that people have used
the people from bybit when they lost their bitcoin if i understand correctly they use
ledgers for signing and the screens are very tiny so so they were not able to verify everything
that they're signing it was sort of a blind signing session that they did from their wallets and that's
how the ethereum was sent to the wrong address or it wasn't even an address it was some sort of
sophisticated contract that was injected in that transaction so it's interesting how this played
out i guess jameson is much better much more versed in this and can understand what happened
what's north korea going to do with the bitcoin now i don't know maybe put it on some joint market
sessions or mix it with one of these third-party wasabi wallet coordinators
it's going to be interesting to see what's going to happen how is north korea going to use this bitcoin
going forward i have no idea it's going to be interesting to observe
well it seems obvious that there's no more capital gains tax for north korea no more tax on tips
they're going to build roads everything's going to be great for their society they're going to live
in citadels yeah citadels i do agree with you vlad it is neat that thor chain didn't reverse the
transactions uh while i doubt that the hackers put all their funds in at once it would have been very
exciting for them to suddenly freeze the hackers coins and uh for them to be caught uh by using too
small of a chain to launder their funds uh not a technical problem a political temporary problem uh
but the funds did go through so that didn't happen the north korean strategic bitcoin reserve
they built theirs their way we built ours uh by robbing from criminals victoria jones what do you
think about the bybit hack and uh their apparent ease at transferring the funds
well i come back to the mantra what doesn't kill you make you makes you stronger i mean again i think it's
all a reflection of uh the stage we're at in bitcoin's development and of course every time something like
this happens uh it's a call to the community to figure out how to stop it i mean obviously
uh a form of decentralized money is different to centralized money where uh you know governments can
step in uh and prevent this um and with a decentralized network we just need to invent new ways of stopping
it and um you know human beings are inherently creative and i'm sure they're going to come up with
something so you know north korea needs to make the most of it because uh these opportunities are not going
to be around for long it's especially interesting because i think in any other environment you'd say
this amount of funds is too large to launder they're going to see you moving the 100 million
whether you move it through tide pods or blockbuster gift cards or walmart cards or whatever it is
they're going to see it uh but with bitcoin we've been able to get over that and thor chain
and ethereum so it's really a while it is kind of a negative invention it's a triumph of a negative
invention this is an incredibly smooth transaction uh from afar uh jameson lopp what do you think
about the success of the north korean hackers in uh laundering their money yeah i mean the actual hack
was the result of about half a dozen things that went wrong and compounded on top of each other uh it was
uh really an evm specific thing they they basically replaced the entire wallet code which was this javascript
web app and uh had at issue i believe a delegate call um command which basically said give full
control uh of this wallet to this other wallet and the other wallet of course was owned uh by lazarus
group now i think there's some interesting points to be made here one point uh that i will claim is that i
don't think that it is feasible for any truly like decentralized permissionless network to do
uh rollbacks or or changes to try to stop a hack or a theft anymore and the main reason for that is
because of how interconnected the entire ecosystem has become and part of that is you know thor chain itself
is one of those bridges uh basically my point being like if you steal funds on one chain and all you can
do is move it around on that chain then it's somewhat likely for people to try to coordinate against you
and try to block you but once you start moving to other chains it just becomes exponentially more um
difficult to coordinate all of those uh you know different interested parties and entities that are
running all of those networks so you know that's why lazarus starts peeling that money off to as many
different networks as possible because it really turns into a game of whack-a-mole and i'm in uh some groups that
are sort of you know voluntary um alliance of trying to stop uh stolen funds and i've been watching them
like even to this day there's still just reams and reams of addresses being posted by people saying this
is related to bybit because they just keep moving it more and more and more and more um another interesting
point is that a couple of days ago the founder of a russian crypto exchange that has facilitated a lot of the
north korean money laundering uh was i believe called garantex he was arrested while vacationing in india
so apparently that was a poor uh planned vacation for him and should have stayed in russia but um
just show that there is coordinated effort at many different levels to try to stem the flow but you know
ultimately i think you're only going to be able to stop some of it just because um you know there's so many
different both centralized exchanges that operate outside of western jurisdictions and
decentralized exchanges that are built to be unstoppable
it's also worth noting recently russia traded a teacher who was caught smoking weed for the leader
of btc dash e uh so there is you know major gangsters out there like he's been saying and
if they're out vacationing maybe they'll get traded back one day in another uh prisoner exchange uh the
market has become that size that nation states are taking interest in this i don't think it's the
last that we'll talk about this but let's move on we've got one more issue uh let's tie it together
here issue five president trump's family is in talks to acquire a stake in binance after the crypto exchange's
guilty plea meanwhile we've also got an update on the libra coin story remember a coin was launched
allegedly backed by the argentinian president but it turned out that perhaps this gentleman hayden davis
is holding all of the money he went on coffee zilla made a couple of interview points but now he's been
added to the red notice list and there's an international capture and detention warrant
for hayden davis from the libra coin argentinian story uh so kind of a grab bag you talk about the
president and the exchange or the libra story uh vlad what do you think about the president maybe
buying part of binance and the libra coin developer or hacker whatever you want to call him on the run
well i i don't think it's the president himself it's probably eric or donald jr or one of his other
sons being interested in this i i don't think about it at all i i do understand it might be some sort of
deal to maybe get a pardon for cz who was the ceo and founder of binance it's dirty i i think so i've
heard this from ray youssef right he used to be the co-founder of paxful now he has another p2p
exchange that's called no one's and he has this theory that basically cz was trying to build the
ultimate network state and he got cut down by the us government and the biggest issue with him basically
was that he sort of imploded ftx when he made that call about the token the ftt token and said that he's
selling most of it and there was a lot of pain that was caused just by that one tweet and that it was
around the time that he was investigated and put in jail for a year or so i don't know there there's so much to
this story and there's so much that i don't know and i don't want to make any statements that might be
wrong it's just that binance is a big business and as far as i know binance is the bank of many citizens
from south america and asia and also africa a lot of the what we call global south is using binance and
they're transferring mostly usdt and they're buying the binance token because they want to get
discounts on the transaction fees so it's sort of a big deal but i've never used it it's funny i've
never used binance i never had an account i think you bring up a really good point vlad that cz can't
join the good old boys club if he's going to be destroying one of the other good old boys and not
to say that sam bankman freed or ftx was really in the network but you got to figure they're holding
on to some of the network's money a lot of people lost money in that we're always trying to tie it
down it doesn't seem to be any of our bitcoin friends but obviously someone invested in ftx someone bought
those tokens and as far as the rest of the strategy we have seen recent success by justin sun paying 45
million dollars and getting himself a pardon so maybe there's a path there if cz sells part of his
company victoria jones what do you think about the trump family perhaps buying into binance and of
course the ongoing libra coin story yeah i can't say i'm surprised really um you know especially if um
you know the us is going to buy a million bitcoin you know why not uh you know buy into the exchange
where some of those purchases are going to be taking place so um you know interesting moves um
i don't think there's a lot we can achieve by worrying about it um you know i think trump now
has a lot of power as a result of being the us president and so you know him and his family are
going to do what they're going to do i think these things you know play out the way they're meant to in
the end and ultimately regardless of the exchanges bitcoin is independent of all of that and so yeah
it'll be interesting to see how it plays out it is certainly a great negotiating position to be in
that's a nice business you got there it'd be a shame if anything happened to it any kind of regulation or
anything like that you know we own this government here right now oh it's a great time to buy
so it's binance us not binance.com so it's a bit different oh you got to start somewhere you
got to start somewhere jameson lop what do you think about the possible president buying
and the ongoing libra coin story which is interesting because it's not facebook libra coin
yeah i mean it's not that interesting uh you know binance us is a pretty small exchange
relatively and it's probably one of the smaller us exchanges um so you know whether or not it's
politically motivated who knows but trump owns a lot of things uh so whatever uh what i think
is more interesting is the hayden davis thing and mainly because this is a recurring theme that i just
find quite amusing which is when these guys go and you know do some sort of really scammy pump and dump or
market manipulation or or other type of activity that's it's not like a direct hack or theft but uh
it is pretty shady and then they go on and they do all these interviews and they basically incriminate
themselves on these interviews i mean sbf did it um uh one of the market manipulator guys who's in prison
now did it he said you know his his argument was oh i was just following the rules of the contract
which he kind of was but apparently there are market manipulation laws that still apply there
so i think it's interesting because i mean we are on you know the cutting edge of finance and so you've
got a lot of these like really young guys who probably don't know much about financial law and they're
investigating these new systems and trying to figure out you know how do i make a bunch of money
and and and so from their perspective they're like oh i'm just you know following the rules of these
systems and uh you know naively i think in many cases just completely breaking a ton of different laws
and then you know you you could say you know maybe it wasn't their fault and they didn't know any better
but uh then they're just not smart enough to shut up uh and you know they go and basically uh publicize
everything that they were doing and essentially incriminate themselves it was amazing on coffee
zilla the guy seemed a surprise that he ended up with the money then he seemed like he didn't know
what to do with it he offered some of it to coffee zilla even saying he could hold one of the keys
i don't know what that would help uh obviously coffee's not going to steal it but they'll just
transfer it to a new account didn't make any sense to me but uh yeah it's very interesting to see that
you know in our world he's just violated a few computer systems pushed a few buttons ended up
with some money uh done a little fake hype you know social engineering doesn't seem that bad uh but like
james is saying if you transfer over to the legal world it's like conspiracy fraud all of these existing
laws which still exist in the digital world uh so i doubt that they would stop these people from doing it
beforehand but it certainly ends up bad afterwards uh ben ark what do you think about possibly the
president buying some of binance us and uh the libra coin hacker yeah it's uh the pump fund crew
touching real world law which we talked about actually in this show uh about whenever whenever it happened
that not that we're supporting the overreaching arm of state of course but stories like that will probably
deter other bros from going that route which might not necessarily be a bad thing uh but it's kind of
normalized behavior sadly in our world or not in our world but you know particularly in the kind of
shitcoin world that if you can make a buck then you make a buck no matter what um and then i suppose
it's up to societies to kind of decide upon i mean they're already pre-existing laws which you can apply to
the cryptocurrency world um but then for wide societies to say well this is immoral you know
and you shouldn't do this thing it should be frowned upon um and then on the the trump thing i mean i
suppose that you know they're buying the serbates ultimately it's skin in the game um which isn't
necessarily a bad thing i would say we've made it you know who would have thought a few years ago that
we've got like a couple of shit coin of presidents one of them's the leader of the free world
um we're there man like the the world has changed it did change in all the ways we didn't think it
would but it has changed um and part of the problem with the ecosystem in which we live in it's and it's
a problem i don't know um some a new reality which we're all going to have to get used to all the the
wide awards going to have to get used to is it's just so easy to manipulate the price and pump anything
up and down particularly if you've got a um a large stage or you're a president or a political uh leader
then you can really impact price um and that's what i think we've seen with with some of the
the trump stuff and then this uh argentinian guy and yeah we're there just like you thomas um
mentioning ask coin before it's 10x since then so i filled my bags thanks we should have gotten in we
all should have got in on the ass coin well uh we're running out of time but let's go to uh
predictions or story of the week victoria jones are you ready with a prediction or a story of the week
go ahead um yeah my story of the week i'm still doing quite a lot of work behind the scenes uh working
up to a big uh relaunch of my website um for the time being the old one is still available and my most
recent letter is uh bitcoin in the welfare state which is on my website satoshispage.com
um so go there check it out i'm just talking about you know how uh what a disaster the uk
government's finances are so anyone who's interested in that might find it interesting
very cool and they can check that out at satoshispage.com
uh jameson lop do you have a prediction or a story of the week go ahead a couple neat tidbits one uh
jack dorsey got locked out of his own x account uh yesterday or two days ago and he posted about
that on nostr um and then also we got much more in-depth detail and actual video of the home invasion
of amaranth in uh i think houston texas uh which was interesting because well i mean she's a well-known
streamer but apparently she had a ton of security cameras inside of her building so you could actually see
what happened when the home invasion uh went down it was pretty crazy it was a very dramatic
video i think she led them to a garage building where her husband was waiting with a gun and a
bulletproof vest he shot one of the assailants in the restaurant away it was a very dramatic story as
i've read on jameson's blog and so forth uh she apparently waived 20 million dollars on her phone in
cryptocurrency at her audience which seems like a bull flag to me uh very horrifying that someone could have
that much money on her phone and uh it really seems like she might have attracted that attention but
it's a good lesson for everyone i think uh ben arc a prediction or story of the week go ahead
um so yeah story of the week um so we're obviously grinding hard on version one lm bits we should be
out next week and uh we've got a couple of paid extensions in the marketplace um which is nice for
developers because you know historically people like developing on it because you have a nice large
user base to share your great idea on in the marketplace but now for the developer they can
charge some sats for it and the flow is really nice you know it's like you just say i want to take the sats
out of this wallet or you pay a qr code or something um but then in that in that process of making the paid
extensions um i was thinking earlier this week about different ways now we have micropayments so it's like
if you think about traditional kind of wordpress model where you buy an extension from your
developers what your developers can now do is rather than charge up front you can just take like a
fraction of a percentage um of a payment from the extension when people use the extension so it could
be like 0.5 percent um but it could be a nice revenue driver for our sort of developer community
and it's just like it was that like uh the the block you know the sort of schemorphic block of
or not of having a new tool just micropayments and then and then looking at an old model which would be
selling plugins in a marketplace and then coming up with like a new idea for how you can monetize a
plugin or something we should selling in a marketplace so i thought it was a pretty cool idea and i want to try
and like work on sort of some examples of it and um get some demos out there and then try and get some
developers to chip in some some extensions but i just i mean i think like i mean vlad before he was
talking about sort of lightning network and the lack of traction but you know you see a lot of good
traction in nasta and for me i'm kind of the opinion you know your protocols are never perfect
and then you just you tweak and you work as best as you can with the tools you've got
and if you look at you know there's probably a million ways in which you could improve http but
you can build all this on top of it and i feel the same way with lightning network it's uh
you just keep building and finding new use cases and um applications are important like you can't just
have like uh you know it's cool to have a world of a billion different protocols but it's also cool to
actually build things on the protocols too um so yeah i thought that was an interesting idea just
the use case of micropayments in that scenario all right let's go to vlad costa for a prediction or
story of the week go ahead vlad i have a couple of stories one is the shortest and the most selfish i
published an interview with marty malami who is the first assistant of satoshi nakamoto and he made
some very interesting points and he told some stories for example he said that he perceived satoshi to
be a 40 year old man and probably not japanese and also probably not cia slash nsa because he was
struggling to configure wordpress which is funny anyway check that out and the other
peter todd sure the other story is that nim launched their vpn yesterday and i watched their launch event and
it's been coming for like four years or five years now it for those who don't know it's a mix net which
means it's this sort of like a coin join but for your internet traffic it's trying to improve on what tor
does today but tor has some known vulnerabilities and issues that can be exploited mix nets are also
randomized and they also break down the data packets in bits of equal sizes and they also do some
time delays and i've been testing that on my phone for the last couple of days and it made my internet
very slow but yeah for me it's exciting i think it's the kind of technology that we should have had many
years ago and they finally figured out a way for this to work for those who want to test it i posted so
they also they also use this mnemonic seed phrase standard for accounts they don't have anything
where you have like a account password or email just like mulvad generates some sort of random number
that becomes your account and then they have 24 words that become your account so i posted that seed phrase
on my twitter account if you want to test it for free because you don't want to pay 12 dollars per month
or something you can do that it it works on up to 10 devices i use it only on two of them so i guess eight
are available so give it a try for me it's exciting i'm not sure if you care much about it but yeah nim vpn
sounds very cool vlad i think we need more vpns and if it was distributed decentralized all those things
i think it'd be very good i don't have that much to say uh this week for a story of the week i was
going to cover briefly i don't know if you guys got it i got kind of a strange email from coinbase and
maybe it's a spam or a phishing email but it says that coinbase is recently not allowed to hold crypto
assets and that they're going to ask everyone to move their funds to something they called coinbase wallet
and that this would be a self-hosted thing and i don't know if this was a real email or not but it
really kind of freaked me out they included the the 24 words or the 12 words or whether in the email
in the body how convenient yeah so i mean i don't know if this is real or not you guys can go look it
up we'll talk about it more next week if it's an issue but just truly horrifying to me that they had
included the words in the body of the email i was like this is very non-standard i don't know whose idea
this was this is very uh so hopefully that's a phishing email not real coinbase but who knows and uh the
other story i had is i just want to talk about this movie that i like that no one else likes
it's called mumford it's from 1999 and i hadn't thought about it in years uh the other day i
started thinking what was that movie with the guy he pretends to be a fake psychiatrist and he kind of
goes to all these small town people and kind of fixes their lives and it's just kind of it's sweet
and it's short and it's not that fancy or anything but look at this cast jason lee from my name is earl
martin short uh the lady from uh home alone ted danson zoe d chanel david pamer uh tons more just
a nice sweet fun movie it's about 26 year old 26 years old i don't know where you're going to find it
uh but it's out there on the internet check out mumford from 1999 it's just a fun nice movie and uh that's
about it for this show thanks to everybody for joining us be sure to give us a thumbs up down
below if you made it to the end of the show go ahead and give us a wave put a wave in the chat or in the
comments and uh subscribe down below and check in next week when we'll be back again and that's about
it so join us next week thanks for joining us this week until next time bye